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Black magic on enhsim

Nov 20, 2009 at 3:40 PM
Edited Nov 20, 2009 at 3:41 PM

Couldn't post my first message here, without first thanking you for the great work you done.

Then...After the tests I've done in PTR i got realy curious with the output of black magic enchant (the 3.3 version of it) on a enhsim simulation. 

Can enhsim take into account the interaction of a black magic proc (250 haste) on the proc of beserking? I know is a diferet project (from you) but does rawr.enhacement takes that into account? or is too low to be considered?

Cheers, Keep up the great work

Nov 20, 2009 at 4:47 PM

If I understand you question correctly, you are asking if the haste from the black magic enchant and the attack power from the berserking enchant will benefit your attacks when they are both active, ie. if they will stack? The black magic enchant isn't integrated yet but ones it is I can assure you that those enchants will stack with each other. I hope that that somewhat answers your question.

I think Levva can answer your question of how this works under rawr.

Nov 20, 2009 at 5:09 PM
My question was since the proc of the beserking enchant is based on a given chance per mellee hit, if the increase haste from black magic could in some way increase the number of procs of beserking (since there are more mellee hits). This could also aplly also to other haste buffs (potion of speed, heroism). 
In theory it should make a diference (and the fact that if beserking procs when black magic procs is diferent from them proccing at diferent times)
I must assume I didn't documented myself enough to know how enhsim does the calculation (if it is a deterministic or a stochastic model of a fight), so realy dont know if my question is too basic.

Again...keep up the great work (I'm actually a noob enhacement shamman, but planed my gear using enhsim and rawr and was doing 6k 3 weeks after I've dinged 80, so im quite happy with it whatever is the "black magic" they do :)
Nov 20, 2009 at 10:07 PM

Yes it will because when you have black magic (and any other haste buff for that matter) the sim will speed up your auto attack swings to account for the haste buff.

Nov 23, 2009 at 11:44 PM

EnhSim will work exactly the same way as an actual boss fight will as it SIMULATES each and every swing and does random rolls to see if you hit miss or crit, more rolls to see if something procs etc.

Rawr.Enhance on the other hand relies on averaging stats. So Rawr will workout the average uptime of each proc and add that to a list of Stats. It then does a whole lot of calculations based on those stats. These include averaging out haste, it iterates over several tries until it smooths out. The results should be similar between the two methods if EnhSim is run for a long enough combat length to smooth out the randomness.

EnhSim will of course be more accurate as its actually simulating combat so if there are odd interactions between two enchants such as this Rawr's method as currently stands might not pick them up. Part of my work on Rawr is to run lots of comparisons like this to see if there are unusual circumstances such as this where the two sims give different figures.

Nov 24, 2009 at 10:56 AM

Thanks for the answer. In fact made some tests in the PTR and with very limited data (5 minutes solo fighting the dummy boss) I could see some changes:

1. A bit more dps (200-300 dps more) when using in the main hand Beserking and with black magic on offhand (comparing with beserking on both hands)

2. When analysing the logs, when using black magic the uptime of beserking was higher that when using 2x beserking in about 10-15% (of course this excludes the simultaneous/stack besrking buff)

Of course this data is very limited (I could have been just "lucky" with the crits on the 2nd try), and i can understand that black magic was "designed" for casters and not melee, but is nevertheless interesting to see this results. My attention for the new black magic enchant was just because how haste is so higly rated on my enhsim EP calculations (arround 2.5EP). If you need the data just tell me and ill send it to you. 

Nov 24, 2009 at 3:31 PM

Unfortunately 5 mins is way too short to give any meaningful answers. Initial calculations have put Black Magic considerably behind dual berserking. Time will tell.